(Andre's raw notes, year 2015, December. Please note that this writing dates back to the end of 2015 and does not take into account everything that happened after 2016. It is therefore to be understood as "truly vintage" Mugler perfumes)
.....phone call to Piatigorsky (again) asking for some infos about Thierry Mugler perfumes. He has good memories, especially about the first perfume that came out: "Angel" (year 1992)
Piatigorsky says it was a milestone in the field of perfumery, Angel was perhaps the first scent to use "gourmand" notes. Famous writer Michael Edwards, in his book "Perfume Legends" dedicates several pages to this perfume (a news to check). Luca Turin's Perfume Guide gives an exceptional 5 stars. It is likely that in the future it will become a collector's item. "Angel" was the first scent to inaugurate the "olfactive dessert" fashion.
"Angel" was an unusual perfume, because after its launch it had an immense, growing success and at the end of the 90s in France it reached the sales of "Chanel No. 5". One of the consequences was that Thierry Mugler's perfumes became much more famous than the clothes and accessoires, to the point that, shortly after 2000, the Thierry Mugler fashion line declined, and only the perfumes remained (very unusual, news to check, again).
Obviously the great success of "Angel" has given rise to an infinite number of clones and, unfortunately, fakes. The first rule is therefore to make sure you have an authentic perfume in your hands.
After year 2000, as usual in those years, an amount of flankers arrived, which makes it easier to date them.
Here Piatigorsky is a bit confusing and one must carefully check what he says.
here's the TIMELINE
1992: Launch of "Angel", the original one.
1996: Launch of "A*Men" (in Europe), then in 1997 "Angel for Men" (outside Europe), but it's the same scent, with two different names.
1998: Innocent
2001: Thierry Mugler Cologne
2004: B*Men
2005: Angel "Garden of Stars" / "Jardin d'Etoiles" (four different fragrances), "Alien".
2006: Angel "Parfums" coffret, and the whole "Summer Flash" line, plus others. (very confusing indeed)
2007 and beyond: a lot of flankers (to check), for Angel, Alien, A*Men.
How to identify vintage bottles?
Website: Piatigorsky remembers the website appeared roughly during the end of 1999/beginning of 2000, at first as "thierrymugler.com"; hence, between 1992 and 1999: no website reported.
Between 2000 and 2007: www.thierrymugler.com
Since 2008: www.mugler.com
The "Thierry Mugler" Signature: this is very important. Between 1992 and 2003/2004 you will find on the boxes the "Thierry Mugler" SLANTED (i.e: inclined, oblique) signature, with the word "Thierry" lower than "Mugler".
Since 2003/2004 you will read "Thierry Mugler" straight, on the same line.
Now, at the end of 2015 you will simply read "MUGLER" (in capital letters).
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| Angel vintage 1992-2004, with "slanted" Thierry Mugler signature ("Thierry" is lower than "Mugler") |
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| Vintage Angel "straight" signature (2004-2015) |
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| Angel, modern box (since 2015) with MUGLER in capital letters |
The alcohol percentage: during first years, you will read on boxes and bottles " 76% " on Angel.
Ingredients: very first bottles have NO ingredient listed; then, a short list of ingredients (alcohol, parfum,water, benzophenone...), between 1995 and 2003.
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| On RIGHT: a very vintage Angel box (year 1994) without any ingredient. on LEFT: an Angel box (year 1995) with the short list of ingredients Note the 76% alcohol on both boxes and the absence of any web-address. |
then, after year 2003, the usual long list of ingredients/allergens appear on the box.
The Address and Factory: this is a bit complicate. Between 1992 and 2007, you will read on labels :"mfd / manufactured for Thierry Mugler", plus the address rue Madeleine Michelis, Neuilly, France.
Between 2007 and 2010 a period of transition occurred, because Mugler perfumes were produced in Pontoise, so you could read "mfd /manufactured for Thierry Mugler, Pontoise"
Since 2010 onwards, we will find the words "mfd for CFG" (Clarins Fragrance Group) in Pontoise" on the labels.
The Distributors. Here's an interesting clue, to check. Piatigorsky remembers that at the beginning Thierry Mugler had several small distributors in each country; then in 1997 he sold the whole distribution to Clarins. This means that during first years you will find in the box the list of all distributors, until years 1997 / 1998.
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| Angel, vintage boxes (1992-1997): the list of different distributors |
Beware of obsolescence: Piatigorsky says you could find old boxes with new batch codes and be fooled. These perfumes are usually authentic, they simply used old boxes until they ran out.
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BATCH CODES FROM 1992 TO 2007 ...and finally, what's about batch codes ? Here Piatigorsky laughs, "I should have expected this question from you!" well, briefly, between 1992 and 2007 you will find a single line of 6 or 7 numbers, and the year of production is the first number: 2-1992, 3-1993, 4-1994, 5-1995, and so on. Of course, you also have to rely on other clues (sign, date of launch, ingredients, etc.) to correctly date perfumes (1994 or 2004? 1996 or 2006? Check the clues!)
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| Angel, batch 607xxx, year 1996 note the early "distributors list". |
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| Innocent, batch 409205, year 2004 |
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| Mugler Cologne, batch 507228, year 2005 |
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| A*Men ICE MEN, batch 761114, year 2007 |
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| A*Men Pure Coffee, batch 711289, year 2007 |
After 2007-2008, when "Pontoise" production started, you will notice a two-lines batchcode on the boxes. A first line with 6 or 7 digits, then a second line with 5 digits only. Well, you have to consider the second line, i.e. the 5-digits one. First two numbers are the year, so: 08301 = year 2008, 09101= year 2009, 10234 = year 2010, 11045= year 2011, 12145= year 2012, and so on. The five digits, YYDDD, represent the year (YY) and day of production (DDD, 001 to 365). For example, 11075 means "produced in 2011, in March". But...
TWO LINES BATCHCODES? BE VERY CAUTIOUS HERE... The BIG problem is that many bottles do NOT show this easy 5-numbers batch code, but the first line only, with 6 or 7 digits. These 6-7 digits batchcodes repeated every 10 years, and in different schemes; this could be *really* misleading. In these cases, you MUST rely on other clues: the web address, Mugler signature, place of production, and the year of launch, but, AGAIN....
Be very careful! The habit of continuing to use old boxes (and therefore with old wording) even in more recent times can be very unnerving. This happens especially with limited-edition perfumes, such as "A*Men Pure xxxx." In these cases, you must rely on batch codes.
TWO LINES BATCH CODES (since 2007 / 2008)
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| Alien batch 08322, year 2008 |
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| Alien, batch 10103, year 2010 |
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| Alien, batch 13294, year 2013 |
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| A*Men Ultra Zest, batch 14344, year 2014 (actually launched in 2015) |
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| A*Men Pure Coffee , batch 14028, year 2014 |
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| Alien, batch code 15355, year 2015 |
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| Angel Vintage EdP, year 2005 |
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| Angel vintage EdP, year 2008 and 2011, you notice a different formula from previous years. |
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| Angel, EdP, year 2015, another reformulation occurred. |
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| Angel flankers, original formula, year 2006 |
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| Alien , EdP , year 2007, formula |
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| Angel Eau de Toilette year 2011, first formula |
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| A*Men Pure Coffee, year 2008, original "formula" |
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| A*Men Pure Malt year 2012, original "formula" |
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| A*Men Pure Leather / Pure Cuir, year 2012, original "formula" |
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| A*Men Pure Wood, year 2014, original "formula" |
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| A*Men Pure Havane, year 2011, original "formula" |
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| A*Men 2010 EdT, formula |
A FEW PICS
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| Angel , vintage bottle: note the infos on the cap. |
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| An obvious fake, full with typo and mistakes. |
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| B*Men, vintage, with "slanted” Thierry Mugler signature. |
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| B*Men, vintage with "Thierry Mugler " straight signature on the same line |
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| Alien, vintage, with "Thierry Mugler" straight signature |
-GUY LAROCHE perfumes (here)
-CACHAREL perfumes ( here )
-ROCHAS perfumes (here)
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